[♪♪] GOOD EVENING.

WELCOME TO KENTUCKY TONIGHT.

I'M RENEE SHAW.

THANKS FOR JOINING US.

OUR TOPIC TONIGHT: AFFORDABLE AND AVAILABLE HOUSING IN KENTUCKY.

RECENT ESTIMATES SHOW THAT KENTUCKY'S HOUSING MARKET IS SHORT MORE THAN 200-THOUSAND HOMES AND RENTAL UNITS.

THE KENTUCKY CHAMBER OF COMMERCE HAS FOUND THAT AS MANY AS 529-THOUSAND NEW HOUSING UNITS WILL NEED TO BE BUILT OVER THE NEXT 25 YEARS TO KEEP PACE WITH ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT AND WORKFORCE GROWTH.

BUT HOW?

WHAT'S CAUSING THE HOUSING SHORTAGE, HOW IS PRICE - EITHER FOR RENT OR HOMEOWNERSHIP - PUSHING SOME OUT OF THE MARKET, AND WHAT ARE SOME POLICY SOLUTIONS THAT COULD MAKE HOUSING MORE AVAILABLE AND AFFORDABLE?

TO DISCUSS THIS, WE ARE JOINED IN OUR LEXINGTON STUDIO BY: WINSTON MILLER, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR AND CEO, KENTUCKY HOUSING CORPORATION; CHARLES AULL, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, KENTUCKY CHAMBER CENTER FOR POLICY AND RESEARCH; STATE REPRESENTATIVE LINDSEY BURKE, A LEXINGTON DEMOCRAT AND MEMBER OF THE KENTUCKY HOUSING TASK FORCE; STATE REPRESENTATIVE SUSAN WITTEN, A LOUISVILLE REPUBLICAN AND CO-CHAIR OF THE KENTUCKY HOUSING TASK FORCE; ADRIENNE BUSH, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR AT HOMELESS AND HOUSING COALITION OF KENTUCKY; AND PAM FEATHERSTONE, PRESIDENT, KENTUCKY REALTORS.

WE WANT TO HEAR FROM YOU.

YOU CAN SEND YOUR QUESTIONS AND COMMENTS BY X — FORMERLY TWITTER -- AT PUB AFFAIRS KET.

SEND AN EMAIL TO K-Y TONIGHT AT K-E-T DOT O-R-G. OR USE THE WEB FORM AT K-E-T DOT O-R-G SLASH K-Y TONIGHT.

OR YOU CAN CALL 1-800-494-7605.

WELCOME TO ALL OUR GUESTS.

THANK YOU FOR JOINING US ON THIS CLOSE TO THE EVE.

BACK TO SCHOOL FOR SO MANY FOLKS.

THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME.

I WANT TO START WITH BASIC INFORMATION BECAUSE A LOT OF OUR VIEWERS FEEL THERE IS A HOUSING SHORTAGE AND HEAR ABOUT IT AND KNOW ABOUT INTEREST RATES Mr. MILLER THEY ARE NOT QUITE SURE.

DO WE REALLY HAVE A HOUSING SHORTAGE?

HOW IS IT DETERMINED THAT WE HAVE A HOUSING SHORTAGE?

CAN YOU GIVE US BASIC EXPLAINER HERE.

>> FIRST OF ALL ABSOLUTELY.

WE HAVE A HOUSING SHORTAGE AND IT IS A SIGNIFICANT HOUSING SHORTAGE.

YOU COULDN'T LEARN ABOUT IT BY TALKING TO MANY, MANY, MANY PEOPLE.

YESTERDAY UP WITH OF OUR FOLKS WERE APPEARING AT THE DEPARTMENT OF LOCAL GOVERNMENT WHERE THE COUNTY JUDGES AND MAYORS WERE, AND KEPT HEARING OVER AND OVER AND RECONFIRMING THE HOUSING SHORTAGE THAT EXISTS IN COMMUNITIES AROUND THE STATE.

IT IS NOT JUST 'URBAN PROBLEM.

IT IS A STATE-WIDE PROBLEM.

WE RECOGNIZE THE NEED FOR PUTTING DEFINITION ON THE EXISTENCE OF THE HOUSING SHORTAGE.

SEVERAL MONTHS AGO, LAST YEAR, WE COMMISSIONED A NATIONAL CONSULTING FIRM TO COME IN AND REVIEW THE DATA AND MAKE A DETERMINATION AS TO WHERE WE STAND IN TERMS OF HOUSING.

THAT WORK PHASE ONE OF THAT REPORT WAS FINISHED IN APRIL OF THIS YEAR.

AND YOU MADE REFERENCE TO THE 200,000 AND I THINK THAT IS PROBABLY WHERE THAT NUMBER CAME FROM.

AND IT'S THE ONE OF THE IMPORTANT THINGS ABOUT THE STUDY THAT KENTUCKY HOUSING HAS DONE IS ANALYZING THE DATA ON A COUNTY BY COUNTY BASIS.

AND THAT AGGREGATES INTO AREAS AND INTO THE STATE AT LARGE.

BUT IT IMPORTANTLY HAS THE COUNTY BY COUNTY DATA.

PEOPLE CAN LOOK AT THEIR OWN COMMUNITIES AND DETERMINE IS THIS DATA ACCURATE?

DOES IT REFLECT THE PROBLEMS WE HAVE OR NOT.

PHASE ONE IS COMPLETE IT'S IN A BOOK YOU CAN FIND A COPY AT KY HOUSING.ORG.

PHASE TWO OF THE REPORT IS A FIVE-YEAR LOOK DOWN THE ROAD.

WHERE ARE WE GOING TO BE IN FIVE YEARS IN TERMS OF THE HOUSING NEEDS WITH THE CURRENT PROJECTED NEW BUILDINGS AND NEW ERECTIONS AND THAT SORT OF THING AND WITH SOME HOUSING GOING OFF LINE.

IT TAKES INTO ACCOUNT MULTIPLE FACTORS.

THE RESULTS THE DEFINITIVE RESULTS OF THAT REPORT WILL BE RELEASED WEDNESDAY MORNING AT THE KENTUCKY AFFORDABLE HOUSING CONFERENCE WHICH WE ARE HOSTING IN LOUISVILLE, KENTUCKY.

WE WOULD ENCOURAGE EVERYBODY TO THINK ABOUT ATTENDING THIS MEETING.

THERE'S INFORMATION FOR IT ON OUR WEBSITE, KENTUCKY HOUSING.ORG.

AND THERE ARE SEATS STILL AVAILABLE.

AND FOLLOWING THAT, ALL OF THE DATA AND ALL OF THE COUNTIES SPECIFIC DATA WILL BE AVAILABLE ON-LINE THROUGH THE KENTUCKY HOUSING CORPORATIONS WEBSITE.

>> Renee: AS YOU DEFINE IT IT IS NOT JUST AN URBAN PROBLEM WE THINK ABOUT LEXINGTON OR LOUISVILLE THIS BEING JUST SOMETHING THAT THEY ARE DEALING WITH.

BUT THE RURAL COMMUNITIES MS. BUSH I WILL LOOK AT YOU ARE DEALING WITH THIS ISSUE ON A SIGNIFICANT SCALE.

>> THANK YOU FOR HAVING ME, RENEE.

I'M GLAD TO BE HERE.

I THINK FROM OUR PERSPECTIVE AT THE HOMELESS AND HOUSING COALITION KENTUCKY WE WERE FORTUNATE IN KENTUCKY THAT ADVOCATES AND PROVIDERS GOT TOGETHER BACK IN THE 80s TO FORM THE HOMELESS AND HOUSING COALITION AND THEY WERE VERY COGNIZANT OF THE FACT THAT THEY HAD HOUSING SHORTAGES EVEN BACK THEN IN THOSE BOTH IN URBAN AND RURAL ISSUE.

AND THAT IS STILL WHAT WE SEE TODAY.

THANKFULLY WE DO HAVE SOME NUMBERS THAT HELP US QUANTIFY ACROSS THE STATE AS WELL AS COUNTY BY COUNTY.

BUT I THINK MY HEART AND THE MINDS OF A LOT OF KENTUCKIANS HAVE THOUGHT ABOUT THE HOUSING NEEDS IN RURAL KENTUCKY, BECAUSE OF THE DISASTERS THAT WE'VE HAD.

IT'S PUT HOUSING FRONT AND CENTER, PARTICULARLY IN EASTERN KENTUCKY AND FAR WEST KENTUCKY.

>> Renee: BECAUSE OF THE FLOODING THAT WE CELEBRATED BUT MARKED THE MILESTONE OF TWO YEARS COMMEMORATED THAT.

THANK YOU.

THIS IS YOUR FIRST TIME ON "KENTUCKY TONIGHT" WE'RE GLAD TO HAVE YOU.

IF YOU WILL FROM THE REALTOR'S PERSPECTIVE WHEN WE TALK ABOUT AFFORDABILITY AND AVAILABILITY IS IT CERTAIN PRICE POINTS WHERE THERE IS A SHORTAGE THAT IS MORE ACUTE THAN AT CERTAIN LEVELS.

WE MAY THINK MORE EXPENSIVE HOMES MAYBE ARE MORE PLENTIFUL THAN A STARTER HOME.

IS THERE A DIFFERENTIATION IN THE AVAILABILITY BASED ON PRICE?

>> NOT REALLY.

THANK YOU FOR BRINGING THIS HOUSING HIGHLIGHTED TONIGHT.

I THINK THIS IS VERY IMPORTANT AND I REALLY WANT TO THANK THE KENTUCKY LEGISLATURE FOR PUTTING THIS TASK FORCE TOGETHER BECAUSE I THINK THAT IS GOING TO ENABLE US TO GET ANSWERS HOPEFULLY.

NO, IN IN ANSWER TO YOUR QUESTION, EVEN THERE ARE NOT ENOUGH HOMES AT ANY PRICE RANGE BUT THE BIGGEST PROBLEM THAT THE REALTORS FEEL IT IS NOT JUST AFFORDABLE IT'S ATTAINABLE.

WHAT IS ATTAINABLE ESPECIALLY FOR FIRST TIME HOME BUYERS OR LOW INCOME HOME BUYERS.

WHAT MAYBE AFFORDABLE TO ME MAY NOT BE AFFORDABLE FOR SOME AND THE SAME WITH PRICING.

WE ARE HAVING THAT PROBLEM AND GETTING THAT FROM SEVERAL AREAS.

IN OTHER WORDS ALL OF A SUDDEN EVERYONE THINKS THEIR LAND IS A GOLDMINE SO THEY SHOULD GET A MILLION FOR IT.

AND WE HAVE PLANNING AND ZONING TRYING TO ELIMINATE THINGS YOU HAVE TO HAVE A CERTAIN LOT SIZE OR HOUSE SIZE AND THEN YOU'VE GOT THE PRICES OF LUMBER AND THINGS FROM THE GOVERNMENT THAT SAYS NOW IN ORDER TO DO A NEW CONSTRUCTION YOU HAVE TO ADD THIS CODE OR THAT ELECTRICIAN OR MORE OF THE PLUMBING THINGS AND THINGS LIKE THAT.

IT'S BECOME UNATTAINABLE FOR THE MAJORITY OF PEOPLE LET ALONE NOT HAVING ENOUGH.

WE HAVE BUILDERS THAT WILL BE GLAD TO START BUILDING HOMES, BUT WE JUST THEY JUST CAN'T GET THE LAND OR CANNOT GET THE LUMBER BOUGHT AT THE PLACES THEY NEED.

>> Renee: OR THE WORKERS.

>> YES, ALL OF IT TOGETHER.

>> Renee: WE'VE HEARD THAT AT ONE OF THE HOUSING TASK FORCES WHICH REPRESENTATIVE YOU ARE THE CO-CHAIR OF.

TALK ABOUT THE REASON AND WE KNOW WHY THIS IS SUCH AN IMPORTANT ISSUE FOR A TASK FORCE TO TO BE FORMULATED.

>> WE ARE EXCITED TO HAVE A HOUSING TASK FORCE AND HAVE IT JUST A BROAD SCOPE NOT ANYTHING TOO NARROW LOOKING AT WHETHER IT'S JUST AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

WE ARE JUST LOOKING AT HOUSING AND EVERYTHING THAT TOUCHES THAT.

IT IS A COMPREHENSIVE LOOK.

SO THE FIRST WE JUST HAD TWO MEETINGS SO FAR.

SO THE FIRST ONE WAS A DATA-CENTRIC.

WE WANTED TO MAKE SURE THAT THE DATA WE HAD WAS CORRECT, THAT WE KNEW AND SO WHEN WE FOUND THE 200 PLUS UNITS THAT WAS THE GAP 200,000.

AND THEN WE'RE STARTING TO DIVE DEEPER INTO THE LOCAL GOVERNMENT, TRYING TO FIND WHAT THEIR STRUGGLES ARE.

AND WHAT THEIR POTENTIAL SOLUTIONS ARE.

AND WE'RE GOING TO GO THROUGH THE SUPPLY CHAIN AS WELL.

LATER ON IN THE EN TISH RIM WE ARE GOING TO LOOK AT OTHER STATES AND TRY AND IDENTIFY THE SOLUTIONS THAT OTHER STATES FOUND.

AS WE KNOW THIS IS NOT A KENTUCKY UNIQUE PROBLEM TO KENTUCKY.

IT'S IMPORTANT TO US BECAUSE WE LIVE HERE AND WE'VE GOT A CRISIS.

BUT THIS IS HAPPENING IN ALL NEAR 50 STATES.

IF WE CAN LOOK OUTSIDE OUR BORDERS AND JUST KEEP OUR MINDS OPEN AND NOTHING MAKING SURE THAT NOTHING IS OFF THE TABLE AND TRY TO FIND REAL SOLUTIONS FOR THIS.

>> Renee: REPRESENTATIVE BURKE, HOW DO YOU FEEL ABOUT THE TASK FORCE, THE WORK THAT IS BEFORE IT, AND ARE THERE CERTAIN POLICIES THAT HAVE BEEN ENACTED PERHAPS THAT WOULD GET IN THE WAY OF MAKING SURE THAT HOUSING IS MORE AVAILABLE AND AFFORDABLE OR ATTAINABLE?

>> ABSOLUTELY.

SO IT'S AN INCREDIBLE PRIVILEGE TO BE ABLE TO BE A MEMBER OF THIS TASK FORCE, BECAUSE THE LACK OF AFFORDABLE AND GENERALLY HOUSING IN THE STATE OF KENTUCKY IS TRULY AT A CRISIS LEVEL.

AND MY BACKGROUND IS THAT I STARTED OFF AS A SOCIAL WORKER WORKING WITH PEOPLE WHO WERE HOMELESS.

THIS IS SOMETHING I'VE CARED ABOUT FOR A LONGTIME.

AND NOW TO BE IN THIS POSITION WHERE I HAVE THE CHANCE TO LEARN AND HELP EFFECTUATE CHANGE IS INCREDIBLE.

REPRESENTATIVE WITNESS 10, I WANT TO TIP MY HAT TO YOU, BECAUSE SO FAR THIS TASK FORCE IS DOING A GREAT JOB OF SURVEYING THE LANDSCAPE.

AND FINDING THE THINGS WE NEED TO KNOW SO WE CAN IMPACT THE LIVES OF KENTUCKIANS.

AND THIS IS ONE OF THOSE RARE MOMENTS IN GOVERNMENT WHERE WE ARE NOT AT EACH OTHER'S THROATS.

WE BOTH SEE THE PROBLEM AND WANT THESE FIXES.

AND I THINK THE WILLINGNESS TO DO THE HARD WORK IS PRESENT.

ONE OF THE CHALLENGES IS THAT THERE IS SORT OF AN INTERNAL DEBATE GOING ON AND WE ARE YET TO RESOLVE IS THIS A STATE GOVERNMENT SOLUTION?

DO WE FIX THIS FROM THE TOP DOWN?

DO WE FIX THIS LOCALLY?

DO WE FIX THIS SOMEWHERE IN-BETWEEN WITH A BLENDING OF STATE AND LOCAL POLICY?

AND I THINK MAYBE HOPEFULLY THAT'S WHERE WE'LL END UP.

BUT JUST IN THE LAST SESSION, WE HAMSTRUNG THE ABILITY OF LOCAL GOVERNMENTS TO ENACT THEIR OWN HOUSING POLICY.

LOUISVILLE AND LEXINGTON HAD LOCALLY APPROVED POLICIES ABOUT RENTING AND WE SAID THEY CAN'T DO THAT.

SO I HOPE THAT MAYBE WE'LL LOOK AT THAT AGAIN.

I DON'T KNOW IF WE WILL.

BUT THAT'S ONE OF THE THINGS I WOULD LIKE TO SEE COME BACK TO THE TABLE IS THE QUESTION OF SHOULD AND CAN LOCAL GOVERNMENTS MAKE THEIR OWN POLICIES TO TRY AND IMPACT LOCAL JURISDICTIONS.

>> Renee: AND THAT IS HOUSE BILL 18 THAT DEALT WITH FEDERAL HOUSING VOUCHERS.

>> YES.

>> Renee: I QUOTED THE CHAMBERS' REPORT EARLIER AND WHY IS THE CHAMBER INTERESTED IN THIS ISSUE?

AND YOU SEEM IN YOUR REPORT THAT IS 55 PAGES LONG DRAW CONNECTIVE TISSUE TO HOUSING AND JOB GROWTH AND ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT.

TELL US HOW THAT IS CONNECTED?

>> I THINK THE LENGTH OF THE REPORT IS A REFLECTION OF THE MAGNITUDE OF THIS ISSUE AND THE WEIGHT IT CARRIES WITH IT.

I THINK HOUSING IS WELL-KNOWN AS A QUALITY OF LIFE ISSUE, A PUBLIC HEALTH ISSUE AND EDUCATION ISSUE.

THAT IS SOMETHING WE ALL KNOW ABOUT AND TALK ABOUT.

WHAT WE WANT TO DO WITH THIS REPORT IS HIGHLIGHT THE ECONOMIC ROLE OF HOUSING AND HOW IT AFFECTS OUR ECONOMY AND THE ABILITY OF OUR ECONOMY TO CONTINUE GROWING.

ONE OF THE THINGS WE STRESS IN THIS REPORT IS THAT KENTUCKY HAS BEEN PUTTING FORTH GOOD POLICY TO HELP US GROW OUR ECONOMY AND POPULATION AND WORKFORCE AND WE ARE STARTING TO SEE THE RESULTS OF THAT.

JUST LAST YEAR WE SURPASSED TWO MILLION NONFARM PAYROLL POSITIONS.

THE FIRST TIME IN HISTORY.

WHAT WE WANT TO DO IS HIGHLIGHT HOW IF WE WANT TO CONTINUE DOWN THAT PATH WHICH WE SHOULD, WE NEED TO MAKE SURE WE HAVE A SOLID HOUSING STRATEGY IF IN PLACE TO ENSURE THAT GROWTH IS SUSTAINABLE.

IN THE REPORT WE HIGHLIGHT THE FACTS THAT WINSTON BROUGHT UP THAT WE'RE DEALING WITH A LOT OF CHALLENGES.

ONE OF THE KEY PIECES OF DATA FOR EXAMPLE, IS COMPARING MEDIAN HOME PRICES TO MEDIAN HOUSEHOLD INCOMES.

AND SOME PARTS OF THE COUNTRY, MEDIAN HOME PRICES WERE ROUGHLY TWO-AND-A-HALF TIMES HOUSEHOLD INCOMES IN 1992.

AND IN 2022 YOU ARE SEEING MEDIAN HOME PRICES FIVE TIMES INCOMES AND THAT IS A REFLECTION OF THE HOUSING CHALLENGES.

SO AS WE CONTINUE GROWING OUR ECONOMY AS WE CONTINUE PUTTING IDEAS ON THE TABLE TO HELP BRING MORE PEOPLE HERE AND BRING MORE WORKERS HERE WE NEED TO HAVE A STRONG HOUSING STRATEGY IN PLACE.

AS REPRESENTATIVE BURKE HIGHLIGHTED THIS IS A TRICKY SPOT FOR STATE LEGISLATORS TO BE DEALING WITH.

WE ARE WATCHING THAT THROUGHOUT THE COUNTRY.

WHEN YOU THINK OF HOUSING POLICY THERE IS A KNOWN ROLE FOR THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT AND LOCAL GOVERNMENT.

HOW THE STATES FIT IN?

A LOT OF STATES ARE ACTING IN THE SPACE LIKE INDIANA, OHIO AND UTAH AND MONTANA AND WE PACKAGE THAT IN THE REPORT TO GIVE THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY LIKE WITTEN SOME OF THE PATHS THEY MIGHT GO DOWN TO FIGURE OUT A PROPER ROLE FOR THE STATE TO PLAY A POSITIVE IMPACT ON THIS ISSUE.

>> Renee: I DO WANT TO GO BACK TO Mr. MILLER TO DEFINE WHAT AFFORDABLE HOUSING IS.

WE TALK ABOUT IT BUT DO WE KNOW WHAT EXACTLY IS AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

>> AFFORDABLE HOUSE SOMETHING A FUNCTION OF THE INCOME LEVEL OF THE PARTICULAR FAMILY, THE PARTICULAR PERSON THAT IS SEEKING TO BE HOUSED OR IS BEING HOUSED.

AND YOU CAN ONLY DO IT VIEW IT IN THAT CONTEXT.

IF THE HOUSEHOLD INCOME IS $SENTENCE,000 A YEAR THE AFFORDABLE HOUSING IS GOING TO BE DIFFERENT THAN IF THEY ARE MAKING $100,000 A YEAR.

WE NEED AFFORDABLE HOUSING FOR PEOPLE AT ALL INCOME LEVELS IN KENTUCKY IN ORDER TO HAVE A SYSTEM THAT WORKS.

NOW, ONE OF THE IMPORTANT THINGS ABOUT THIS IS THAT THESE ARE NOT SINGULAR BUCKETS IT IS NOT A BUCKET FOR AFFORDABLE HOUSING A BUCKET FOR WORKFORCE HOUSING OR UPPER INCOME HOUSING.

EACH OF THESE BLEND TOGETHER INTO A CONTINUUM.

AND THE INCREASING HOUSING IN ONE AREA IS GOING TO BLEED OVER AND INCREASE HOUSING IN OTHER AREAS AS WELL.

SO THE MORE JOB FORCE HOUSING WE HAVE, THE MORE AFFORDABLE HOUSING IF THAT'S A LESSER INCOME LEVEL THAT WE'RE GOING TO MAKE AVAILABLE.

BECAUSE IT IS A CONTINUUM.

>> Renee: WE OFTEN HEAR IT SHOULDN'T BE MORE THAN 30% OF YOUR INCOME YOUR HOUSEHOLD EXPENSES AND MORE THAN JUST YOUR MORTGAGE OR YOUR RENT.

DO YOU THINK THAT IS A GOOD RULE OF THUMB?

>> I THINK IT'S THE GENERALLY ACCEPTED RULE OF THUMB.

IT IS WHAT WE HAVE AGREED IS FAIR.

I THINK IT IS RENT OR MORTGAGE PLUS UTILITIES AS I HAVE LIVED MY LIFE, MY ADULT LIFE I'VE TRIED TO LIVE WITHIN THOSE MEANS.

AND IT GENERALLY WORKS OUT.

WHEN YOU DO HAVE PRESSURES LIKE EXTREMELY LOW INCOME RENTERS WHERE THEY ARE PAYING MORE THAN HALF OF THEIR RENT 6 OUT OF 10 WERE RENTING ARE IN THAT SITUATION.

THAT'S WHEN IT BECOMES UNSUSTAINABLE.

>> IF I COULD ADD-ON THE AFFORDABILITY ISSUE, IT'S THE COST BURDEN IS A REAL FACTOR IN THE HOUSING ANALYSIS DONE.

IN KENTUCKY 44% OF THE RENTERS ARE COST BURDENED IN THE SENSE OF THEIR RENT BEING EXCESS OF THE 30%.

IN TERMS OF EXTREME COST BURDEN, THERE'S 24% ALMOST THAT WHERE THEIR INCOMES THEIR EXPENSES OR HOUSING EXPENSES ARE EQUAL TO 50% OF THEIR INCOME.

SO YOU KNTS' ANALYZE WHERE WE ARE AND WHERE WE NEED TO GO WITHOUT A FOCUS ON COST BURDEN AND HOW TO HAVE HOUSING THAT ACCOMMODATES THAT.

>> Renee: IT'S ALSO A BURDEN FOR LOCAL OFFICIALS ACROSS THE STATE WHO ARE LOOKING AT ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT AND HOW THEY CAN GROW THEIR POPULATIONS AND TAX BASE BECAUSE HOUSE SOMETHING A CONCERN.

AND RECENTLY AT ONE OF THE MOST RECENT HOUSING TASK FORCES OUR JUNE LOEFFLER WAS THERE AND TOOK THE TEMPERATURE AND HEARD THE TEMPERATURE OF LOCAL OFFICIALS WHO TALKED ABOUT THE HOUSING BURDEN.

>> THE BLUE OVAL SK BATTERY PLANTS ARE BRINGING THOUSANDS OF JOBS AND PEOPLE TO HARDEN COUNTY.

THE MAYOR SAYS THAT GROWTH IS SENDING HOUSING PRICES SKYROCKETING CAUSING A BURDEN IN HIS OWN HOME.

>> I HAVE A 24-YEAR-OLD SON HANOVER GRAD AND IS WORKING SELLING INSURANCE FOR A FIRM HERE IN KENTUCKY THAT IS WELL-KNOWN AND HE IS DOING A GOOD JOB BUT STILL LIVING AT MY HOUSE BECAUSE HE IS NOT MARRIED AND DOESN'T HAVE TWO INCOMES TO FIND SOMETHING THAT IS AFFORDABLE THAT HE CAN AFFORD.

WE NEED TO TACKLE THAT PROBLEM BECAUSE I NEED TO FREE UP SPACE IN MY HOUSE, TOO.

>> THIS ISN'T UNIQUE TO HARDEN COUNTY.

ELECTED LEADERS FROM COMMUNITIES OF ALL SIZES TELL KENTUCKY LAWMAKERS THEY NEED MORE HOUSING FOR EVERYONE.

CITY OFFICIALS SAY LOUISVILLE IS SO POPULOUS IT DOESN'T HAVE ENOUGH LAND TO BUILD OUT.

SO IT WILL HAVE TO BUILDUP.

>> IF WE DON'T ADD DENSITY TO OUR CITY TO OUR COUNTY WE WILL NOT BE ABLE TO GROW AS A CITY.

WE WILL NOT GROW THE ECONOMY.

>> HE IS NOT TALKING ABOUT 17 STOREY BUILDINGS FULL OF PEOPLE THAT NEED MORE SERVICES THAN WE CAN PROVIDE.

I LIVE IN THE HIGHLANDS IN LOUISVILLE.

YOU MIGHT WALK PAST A SINGLE FAMILY HOME AND THE HOME NEXT DOOR IS A DUPLEX AND THE HOME NEXT DOOR IS AN APARTMENT BUILDING AND IT IS A BEAUTIFULLY DIVERSE NEIGHBORHOOD.

>> RURAL COUNTIES NEED INFRASTRUCTURE TO SUPPORT DEVELOPERS AND RESIDENTS.

>> AND SPECIFICALLY IN MARSHALL COUNTY, THE AREAS WHERE YOU WOULD BE ABLE TO DO THAT OUTSIDE THE CITIES, THAT WOULD ALLOW THAT MUCH DEVELOPMENT UNFORTUNATELY WE DON'T HAVE THE INFRASTRUCTURE THERE ALREADY.

>> BOON COUNTY OFFICIALS SAYS EVERYONE FROM FOLKS ON FIXED INCOMES TO COLLEGE EDUCATED PROFESSIONALS STRUGGLE TO FIND AN AFFORDABLE HOME.

>> WHAT WE FOUND RIGHT AWAY, DO A GREAT JOB OF BUILDING THREE AND FOUR BEDROOM SINGLE FAMILY HOUSES.

WHAT WE'RE NOT BUILDING IS ONE BEDROOM AND TWO BEDROOM UNITS WHETHER OWNER OCCUPIED OR RENTAL.

>> FEDERAL HOUSING VOUCHERS DO HELP SOME OF THE LOWEST INCOME RENTERS.

SOME CITIES HAD WAYS TO MANDATE LANDLORDS RENT TO TENANTS WITH THE VOUCHERS.

BUT THIS YEAR LAWMAKERS MADE THOSE BANS ILLEGAL WITH THE PASSAGE OF HOUSE BILL 18.

FOR "KENTUCKY TONIGHT" I'M JUNE LOEFFLER.

>> Renee: THANKS TO JUNE FOR THAT.

I WANT TO GO TO YOU PAM FEATHERSTONE AND TALK ABOUT AS CHARLES WAS SAYING HOW THERE'S FEDERAL POLICY THAT COMES INTO PLAY AND LOCAL POLICY BUT NOT SURE OF THE STATE ROLE.

THAT FEDERAL POLICY AND THE INTEREST RATES AND HOW MUCH THAT IS A BARRIER FOR HOMEOWNERSHIP IN PARTICULAR?

>> INTEREST RATES HAVE CREATED A PROBLEM TO SOME DEGREE AND PART OF THAT HAS BEEN WHEN YOU'VE GOT PEOPLE THAT ARE LIVING IN HOMES THAT THEY WOULD LIKE TO MOVE OUT OF TO MAYBE MAKE ROOM TO DOWNSIZE OR UP SIZE AND THEY CAN'T DO THAT BECAUSE EVEN THOUGH HOME PRICES INCREASED THEY CAN'T PAY ENOUGH DOWN PAYMENT TO GET THAT HOUSE PAYMENT DOWN SO THAT THEY CAN MAKE THAT MOVE.

THEY ARE NOT GOING TO GIVE UP THAT LOWER INTEREST RATE TO GO FOR A HIGHER INTEREST RATE AT THAT PARTICULAR TIME.

THAT IS JUST ADDING TO THE PROBLEM AT THIS TIME.

YES, MA'AM.

>> Renee: I WANT TO GO TO A POINT THAT WAS MADE IN THE PIECE THAT JIM PUT TOGETHER FOR US AND I CALL IT NOT IN MY BACKYARD.

YOU HEARD ABOUT A MIXED-USE WHERE YOU MIGHT LIVE AND THE HOUSING OFFICIAL THERE FROM JEFFERSON COUNTY YOU MIGHT HAVE A DUPLEX, A TOWNHOUSE HOME AND IT IS A BEAUTIFUL AREA.

BUT NOT EVERYBODY WANTS TO LIVE LIKE THAT.

CHARLES AULL?

>> ON THIS PANEL ALL OF US CAN THROW OUT DIFFERENT POLICY SOLUTIONS AND STRATEGIES TO GET AROUND THE NEED FOR MORE HOUSING.

AT THE END OF THE DAY WE'RE GOING TO FACE TWO SOURCES OF HEADWINDS.

ONE IS THE WORKFORCE SIDE WHERE WE DO NOT HAVE THE SHEER AMOUNT OF BUILDERS THAT WE USED TO HAVE AND THE WORKERS WE USED TO HAVE.

WE'VE TALKED THROUGH THE DEFICIT THAT KENTUCKY IS FACING THE 206,000 IS AN EXAMPLE OF THAT WE'RE GOING TO NEED A LOT OF WORKERS.

THE OTHER SIDE IS NO MATTER WHAT WE DO THE DECISIONS WILL BE AT MINIMUM INFLUENCED AT THE LOCAL LEVEL.

AND WHEN WE SAY AT THE LOCAL LEVEL WE'RE TALKING NEIGHBORHOOD BY NEIGHBORHOOD.

AND ONE OF THE THINGS WE NEED TO WORK TOGETHER ON IS SELLING A MESSAGE TO KENTUCKIANS THAT MORE HOUSING IS GOOD.

WE NEED MORE HOUSING TO HOUSE FOLKS WHO NEED IT THE MOST AND NEED MORE HOUSING TO ACCOMMODATE GROWTH AND MAKE SURE WE HAVE SUSTAINABLE GROWTH.

A HUGE PART OF THIS CONVERSATION HAS TO BE TALKING NEIGHBOR TO NEIGHBOR AND GOING TO COMMUNITY MEETINGS AND GETTING FOLKS MORE ONBOARD WITH THE HOUSING THAT WE NEED.

SOMETHING A FRIEND OF OURS WITH THE HOMEOWNERS ASSOCIATION OF KENTUCKY WHO WE PUBLISHED THIS REPORT IN PARTNERSHIP WITH ONCE TOLD ME THAT WHEREVER YOU ARE LIVING RIGHT NOW, THERE IS A GOOD CHANCE SOMEBODY PROBABLY OPPOSED YOUR OWN HOUSING.

WE ALL NEED TO KEEP THAT IN MIND WHEN WE THINK ABOUT OUR OPINIONS ON HOUSING PROJECTS THAT MIGHT BE NEXT DOOR TO US.

WE NEED THIS HOUSING.

IT IS NOT JUST A GOOD THING FOR OUR ECONOMY BUT EVERYDAY KENTUCKIANS.

WE HAVE TO CHANGE OUR MINDSET AROUND THESE ISSUES.

>> Renee: DO YOU AGREE WITH THAT?

>> 100%.

I THINK WHAT THIS HAS TAUGHT US WHAT IT'S TAUGHT ME IS THAT IT IS A STATE-WIDE HOUSING SHORTAGE, BUT WE CAN ALL SEE OURSELVES IN THIS PICTURE.

SEVEN YEARS AGO WHEN I STARTED IN THIS ROLE, I COULD TALK ABOUT THE HOUSING SHORTAGE PARTICULARLY FOR VULNERABLE KENTUCKIANS, EXTREMELY LOW INCOME FOLKS AND NOW WE'VE GOTTEN TO A POINT WHERE THE HOUSING SHORT ANG IS CREATING HAVOC ALL OVER THE PLACE IT'S NOT WORKING FOR MOST OF US.

THAT IS THE OPPORTUNITY THERE.

WE CAN ALL SEE OURSELVES AS THE HERO IN THIS STORY.

THAT WE NEED MORE HOUSING AND WE'RE GOING TO FIGURE OUT WAYS TO GET THERE.

>> Renee: DENSITY IS THE KEY THAT WE HEARD MAYOR GREENBURG TALK ABOUT AT THAT LAST MEETING THAT YOU HAVE THE COMMUNITIES THAT HAVE ALL KINDS OF OPTIONS.

>> YES, ABSOLUTELY RENEE.

I THINK THAT I LOVE THE WAY YOU PHRASED IT AS WE'RE ALL THE HEROS IN THE STORY BECAUSE THAT IS AN OPPORTUNITY FOR US ALL TO SUCCEED TOGETHER.

AND SOME OF THE PUSHBACK YOU HEAR ABOUT IN THE NIMBY REFLECTIONS IT'S GOING TO HURT MY HOME VALUE.

YOUR HOME'S NEVER BEEN WORTH MORE.

AND WHEN YOUR CITY GROWS AND YOUR TOWN GROWS YOUR HOME'S GOING TO CONTINUE TO INCREASE IN VALUE.

WHEN YOUR HOME HAS FEWER PEOPLE WHO ARE UNHOUSED IT'S MORE ATTRACTIVE.

EVERY SINGLE THING THAT WE DO TO INCREASE THE SUPPLY OF HOUSING ISN'T GOING TO CUT US OFF AT THE KNEES.

THOSE VALUES WILL CONTINUE TO GROW.

AND IF WE THINK ABOUT HOW TO DO IT THOUGHTFULLY, BEAUTIFULLY, AND CONSUME NATIONALLY, IT'S GOING TO IMPROVE OUR ECONOMICS IT WILL I AM ENTREPRENEUR OUR WAY OF LIFE AND OUR WELL-BEING AND SENSE OF HOME.

THIS IS A WONDERFUL OPPORTUNITY FOR US TO REIMAGINE WHAT COMMUNITY MEANS.

>> Renee: GO AHEAD.

>> THAT IS SOMETHING THAT THE REALTORS HAVE BEEN TRYING TO DO IS EXPLAIN TO HOMEOWNERS IF WE ARE INCREASING HOMES AND IF WE ARE INCREASING DENSITY, IT IS A GOOD THING FOR YOU.

IT IS JUST MAKING THINGS BETTER THAT IS SOMETHING THAT WE HAVE BEEN VERY STRONG ABOUT EXPLAINING TO PEOPLE.

DON'T BE AFRAID.

AND AS CHARLES SAID, YES, SOMEONE ONCE OPPOSED TO WHERE YOU ARE LIVING NOW.

LET US EXPAND THESE THINGS AND MAKE IT BETTER BECAUSE ALL THIS IS GOING TO DO AS NEW HOMES ARE BUILT IT INCREASES YOUR VALUE.

>> Renee: GO AHEAD.

>> AS WE'RE TALKING ABOUT DENSITY, WE HAVE TO RECOGNIZE THAT WE LIVE AND WORK AND PLAY NOW VERY DIFFERENTLY THAN WE DID FOUR OR FIVE YEARS AGO.

COMING FROM LOUISVILLE, I LOOK AT DOWNTOWN LOUISVILLE AND THERE ARE A LOT OF COMMERCIAL BUILDINGS THAT PEOPLE DO NOT WORK IN THEIR BUILDINGS ANYMORE.

AND SO THERE IS A GREAT OPPORTUNITY FOR THOSE BUILDINGS TO REZONE THEM TO RESIDENTIAL.

ESPECIALLY WHEN THE CHALLENGE THAT WE'RE HAVING IS INFRASTRUCTURE.

IT'S NOT SO SIMPLE TO JUST BUILD HOUSES WITHOUT THE INFRASTRUCTURE.

SO SOME OF THESE THINK OUTSIDE THE BOX THINGS IS TAKE THESE COMMERCIAL BUILDINGS THAT ARE RIGHT NEXT TO HOSPITALS, WHAT BETTER PLACE FOR NURSES TO LIVE IS THESE ARE THESE FACILITIES.

SO I THINK THAT SOME OF THOSE IDEAS ARE SOMETHING THAT WE NEED TO LOOK AT.

>> Renee: HAVE YOU DETERMINED WHAT THE STATE ROLE IS?

WHEN IT COMES TO THIS ISSUE OF HOUSING.

BECAUSE YOU HAVE THE FEDERAL POLICY AND LOCAL GOVERNMENTS CAN DO, WHAT IS THE ROLE OF THE STATE GOVERNMENT WHEN IT COMES TO THIS ISSUE?

>> IT IS A REALLY TIGHT ROPE.

AND IT'S ONE THAT IF WE CAN IDENTIFY SOLUTIONS SOME OF IT MIGHT NOT BE THAT WE WOULD PUT FORWARD LEGISLATION.

SOME WOULD BE THAT WE COULD RECOMMEND REGULATIONS BEING CHANGED, HAVING CONVERSATIONS WITH LOCAL GOVERNMENT.

SOME TO HAVE IS GOING TO BE OUR INFLUENCE AND NOT NECESSARILY LEGISLATION.

>> Renee: DO YOU AGREE WITH THAT APPROACH THAT MAYBE IT'S BEST LEFT AT THE LOCAL LEVEL AND THE FEDERAL DICTATES?

>> I THINK THERE'S SEVERAL DIFFERENT WAYS THAT THE STATE CAN INTERVENE.

THINK ABOUT SOMETHING LIKE LAND USE AND ZONING REFORM.

THAT IS SOMETHING THAT IS GOING TO BE HEAVILY FOCUSED AT THE LOCAL LEVEL BUT INDIANA FOR EXAMPLE, INDIANA PASSED LEGISLATION IN 2023 WHERE THEY LAID OUT A NUMBER OF BEST PRACTICES THAT THEY RECOMMENDED FOR LOCAL GOVERNMENTS TO CONSIDER.

AND THEN GAVE LOCAL GOVERNMENTS THE OPPORTUNITY TO ACCESS SOME ADDITIONAL FUNDING IF THEY WERE TO ADOPT THE BEST PRACTICES.

THAT LEVEL OF GUIDANCE CAN BE HELPFUL AND INCENTIVIZING THAT.

WE HAVE TO TAKE A LOOK AT SOME OF THE REGULATORY BARRIERS THAT MIGHT EXIST THAT DO EXIST AT THE STATE LEVEL.

ONE OF THE THINGS WE HIGHLIGHT IS THE WAY FOR EXAMPLE LABOR UNEMPLOYMENT LAW CAN CONTRIBUTE TO THE OVERALL COST, THE END COST OF HOUSING.

WITH THINGS LIKE ENERGY ROADS, BUILDING CODES THOSE THINGS ARE IMPORTANT WE NEED TO HAVE THOSE THINGS HOWEVER WE HAVE TO BE COGNIZANT HOW THEY MIGHT INFLATE THE COST OF HOUSING.

>> Renee: SOME PEOPLE WOULD FEAR YOU WOULD RELY ON SUBSTANDARD.

>> IF WE TAKE A METHODICAL APPROACH AND HOW IT MIGHT BE CONTRIBUTING TO COST WE CAN MAKE GOOD DECISIONS HOW TO DO IT.

OTHER AREAS THAT I THINK THE STATE CAN INTERVENE IS STRENGTHENING OUR AFFORDABLE HOUSING TRUST FUND SOMETHING THAT WE WILL BE TALKING ABOUT THROUGHOUT THE COURSE OF THIS IS THE ISSUE OF BUILDING AFFORDABLE HOUSING WHEN THE COST OF MATERIALS AND LABOR IS HIGHER THAN IT USED TO BE.

HAVING A STRONG AFFORDABLE HOUSING TRUST FUND THAT CAN HELP COVER THE COSTS AND FINALLY ONE OF THE BIGGEST ISSUES WE HAVE TO RECKON WITH IS SOLVING THAT WORKFORCE CRISIS WITHIN THE BUILDING WORKFORCE.

THINK BEING THINGS LIKE THE KENTUCKY WORK READY SCHOLARSHIP.

SOME OF OUR OTHER SCHOLARSHIP PROGRAMS THAT CAN PLAY A HUGE ROLE IN MAKING SURE WE HAVE THE BUILDERS AND THE QUALIFIED CONSTRUCTION WORKFORCE THOSE ARE CRITICAL STEPS.

>> Renee: IT MAY NOT BE IMMEDIATE.

IF YOU WERE TO DO THAT NEXT SESSION IT DOESN'T MEAN BY THE FALL YOU HAVE A WORKFORCE THAT YOU NEED?

>> THAT'S CORRECT.

IT'S GOING TO TAKE A WHILE.

AND THERE IS A HEAVY DEMAND FOR CONSTRUCTION WORKERS RIGHT NOW WITH THINGS LIKE ROAD CONSTRUCTION, UNIVERSITY EXPANSIONS AND THE PROJECTS.

THAT MEANS WE NEED TO GET STARTED AS SOON AS HUMANLY POSSIBLE AND MAKING SURE WE'RE BUILDING THE WORKFORCE.

>> Renee: Mr. MILLER WHO DO YOU THINK ABOUT THE SUGGESTIONS Mr. AULL MENTIONED?

>> I THINK THEY ARE ALL POSSIBILITIES AND GOOD ANALYSIS OF OPTIONS.

I THINK THE GOT A PAGE FROM THE CHAMBER REPORT RIGHT HERE IN FRONT OF ME.

AND THEY'VE GOT SEVEN SOLUTIONS CONCEPTUAL SOLUTIONS THAT THEY'VE RECOMMENDED AND I THINK ALL OF THEM HAVE MERIT.

AND WHAT NEEDS TO HAPPEN IN THE FUTURE IS YOU NEED TO GET A SHARPER POINT ON THE PENCIL AS TO HOW TO IMPLEMENT THOSE RESOLUTIONS.

WHAT DOES IT REALLY MEAN WHEN YOU SAY EXPLORE AND ENCOURAGE LOCAL LAND USE REFORM AND ZONING?

WHAT DO YOU MEAN WHEN YOU SAY CONSIDER REGULATIONS THAT IMPACT.

THESE VERY HIGH LEVEL RECOMMENDATIONS ARE EXCELLENT.

AND I DON'T THINK THERE'S ANYTHING THAT WE WOULDN'T THINK IS APPROPRIATE.

THERE ARE OTHER SOLUTIONS, THOUGH.

AND OTHER STATES AROUND US, CHARLES MADE REFERENCE TO WHAT OTHER STATES HAVE DONE AROUND US AND WE'VE SUPPLIED THE TASK FORCE COMMITTEE WITH A LETTER FOLLOWING OUR PRESENTATION A COUPLE MONTHS AGO WITH A LIST OF WHAT SEVERAL STATES ARE DOING AROUND US.

AND CHARLES MENTIONED INDIANA.

AND THAT'S A GOOD EXAMPLE.

MONTANA HAS DONE SIMILAR THINGS.

OKLAHOMA, HAS APPROPRIATED $200 MILLION IN DEVELOPMENT LOANS TO HELP BUILDERS HAVE THE FINANCING TO BUILD SINGLE FAMILY AND MULTIFAMILY HOMES ESSENTIALLY PROVIDE A BANK AT LOW INTEREST RATES IN ORDER TO FACILITATE THE CONSTRUCTION OF HOUSING.

MICHIGAN AND OHIO HAVE DONE SIMILAR THINGS.

I THINK THE TASK FORCE AND THOSE INVOLVED IN MAKING THESE POLICY DECISIONS NEED TO CLOSELY ANALYZE WHAT OTHER PEOPLE HAVE DONE AND LOOK OUTSIDE JUST OUR STATE TO FIND EXAMPLES OF SOLUTIONS TO THE PROBLEM.

>> Renee: REPRESENTATIVE BURKE YOUR TAKE ON THE SOLUTIONS DISCUSSED?

>> WELL, IT'S FUN TO BE ABLE TO SAY I AGREE WITH A LOT OF WHAT I'M HEARING.

I WOULD ADD THAT I THINK WE REALLY NEED TO PRIORITIZE WORKFORCE.

THE WORK READY SCHOLARSHIPS NEED TO BE A TOP LINE ITEM BECAUSE THAT DOESN'T ONLY BENEFIT CONSUMERS THAT BENEFITS THE PEOPLE GOING INTO TRADES.

THOSE ARE GREAT JOBS AND WHEN YOU CAN ACCESS THOSE GREAT JOBS YOU HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY FOR SUCCESS AS WELL.

ALSO I THINK WE REALLY WE WILL MISS AN OPPORTUNITY IF WE DON'T FIND ANOTHER TOOL FOR INVESTING INTO THE AFFORDABLE HOUSING TRUST FUND.

RAISING IT ON THE CONSUMER THEMSELVES WHEN PRICES ARE AT ALL TIME HIGHS AND INTEREST RATES ARE FALLING BUT THEY ARE STILL HIGHER THAN THEY HAVE BEEN OVER THE LAST 10 YEARS THAT IS A PRESSURE ON FIRST TIME HOME BUYERS.

WE COULD LOOK AT SOLUTIONS THAT ARE MORE FAVORABLE TO THE BUYERS AND PERHAPS SOMETHING LIKE A QUARTER OF A PERCENT FOR MORTGAGE COMPANIES PUT INTO THE AFFORDABLE HOUSING TRUST FUND.

IT'S NOT COMING FROM THE CONSUMER BUT THE CORPORATIONS THAT THE ARE BENEFITING FROM THAT.

THAT MIGHT NOT BE EVERYBODY'S FIRST CHOICE BUT THAT IS AN OPPORTUNITY FOR US TO TALK TO ABOUT HOW DO WE GET THAT MONEY INTO PLAY AND IT'S NOT COMING OUT OF THE TAX ROLLS.

I THINK THAT IS SOMETHING WE OUGHT TO BE CONSIDERING.

AND LASTLY, I THINK IT IS A GREAT TIME FOR US TO CONSIDER WHETHER OR NOT WE DO WANT TO RELIEVE REGULATIONS.

THERE'S BEEN A TENDENCY OVER THE LAST FEW SESSIONS TO LOOK AT DISASSEMBLING THE REGULATORY STATE AND MAKING IT EASIER TO BE A TEACHER AND MAKING IT EASIER TO BE A NURSE AND ALL THESE DIFFERENT THINGS.

BUT I WORRY WHEN IT COMES TO THE FUNDAMENTAL BEDROCK WHERE YOU LAY YOUR HEAD AT NIGHT I DON'T WANT TO SEE VULNERABLE KENTUCKIANS BE THE MOST LIKELY TO END UP IN A HOME THAT ISN'T SAFE.

SO I DON'T WANT US TO RACE TO THOSE SOLUTIONS WHEN WE CAN LOOK AT OTHER SOLUTIONS FIRST.

>> Renee: DO YOU AGREE WITH THAT LAST POINT?

>> I THINK ON ONE HAND, WE DO NEED TO LOOK AT OUR HOUSING COSTS AND WHAT ROLE REGULATIONS DO PLAY IN DRIVING THOSE.

AT THE SAME TIME, WE ALL WANT A SAFE PLACE TO LAY OUR HEADS.

I THINK IT IS INCUMBENT UPON US WHEN WE ARE TALKING ABOUT THE AFFORDABLE HOUSING TRUST FUND AND THE RURAL HOUSING TRUST FUND, TO KIND OF REEXAMINE HOW WE ARE FUNDING THOSE.

I'M NOT SURE, I THINK WE'RE OPEN TO IT.

TO THE DIFFERENT METHODS OF FUNDING IT.

RIGHT NOW, THE EXISTING AFFORDABLE HOUSING TRUST FUND IS FUNDED BY A $6 PER TRANSACTION FEE.

AND WE ARE SO GRATEFUL TO THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY FOR DEDICATING THAT REVENUE BACK IN 2007 BUT I THINK WE ARE ALL IN AGREEMENT THAT IT'S NOT QUITE TO THE SCALE THAT WE NEED IT TO BE.

SO THAT WOULD BE SOMETHING THAT I WOULD BE LOOKING FOR TO COME OUT OF THIS TASK FORCE IS MODERNIZING OR STREAMLINING HOW WE FUND OUR HOUSING TRUST FUNDS, BOTH THE ORIGINAL AFFORDABLE HOSING TRUST FUND AND THE NEWLY CREATED RURAL HOUSING TRUST FUND.

>> Renee: WHAT DO YOU THINK OF THOSE IDEAS?

>> I THINK ALL OF THE IDEAS ARE INTERESTING AND I HAVEN'T HEARD ONE THAT IS NOT WORTH A CONVERSATION.

I DO THINK THAT FUNDING THOSE IS IMPORTANT AND IF IT'S SOMETHING THAT WE HAVEN'T LOOKED AT IN CLOSE TO 20 YEARS, WITH ALL THAT HAS CHANGED IN THE LAST 20 YEARS, I THINK IT WARRANTS A LOOK.

ABSOLUTELY.

>> Renee: THIS QUESTION FROM A VIEWER.

PAM FEATHERSTONE I WILL GIVE THIS TO YOU ONE OF THE BIGGEST PROBLEMS I SEE IS FARMERS UNWIG TO GIVE UPLAND TO BUILD.

IS THAT OVERSIMPLIFICATION?

>> NOT REALLY.

THERE ARE A LOT OF PEOPLE THAT ARE UNWILLING TO GIVE UP SOME OF THEIR LAND AND IT'S THE NIMBY THING NOT IN MY BACKYARD AGAIN.

AND I THINK MAYBE INCENTIVIZING SOME OF THESE PLACES TO ALLOW US TO DO SOMETHING BRINGING FORTH GOOD IDEAS.

IT'S POSSIBLE TO JUST SIT DOWN WITH PEOPLE AND JUST TRY TO EXPLAIN TO THEM THE BENEFITS OF MAYBE YOU DON'T HAVE TO SELL THE WHOLE FARM MAYBE A PORTION OF IT OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT.

YEAH, A LOT OF PEOPLE ARE HOLDING ON TO THINGS BECAUSE THEY DON'T KNOW WHAT THE FUTURE HOLDS AND WE CAN UNDERSTAND THAT.

BUT I THINK WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE HOMELESS PROBLEM AND YOU LOOK AT THE HOUSE ATTAINABILITY AS FAR AS FINANCIALS GO WE HAVE TO DO SOMETHING AND IT WILL TAKE THE EFFORT WITH EVERYBODY ACROSS THE AREA TO GET THIS THING DONE.

AND SOMETHING ELSE WE'VE TRIED TO PROMOTE ON THE REALTORS SIDE TO PROMOTE OWNERSHIP IS THE FIRST TIME HOME BUYER SAVINGS ACCOUNT THAT WE TALKED ABOUT THAT.

THAT IS SOMETHING THAT YOU WOULD POSSIBLY PUT INTO PLACE AND NOT EVERYONE IS GOING TO BE ABLE TO TAKE ADVANTAGE OF IT BUT LIKE YOUR HEALTH PLANS THEY CAN PUT TAX MONEY BACK TO THE SIDE AND SAVE UP FOR A DOWN PAYMENT.

THAT IS SOMETHING THAT POSSIBLY WE COULD LOOK AT DOING ALSO.

>> Renee: YOU HAVE TO THINK ABOUT THE INFRASTRUCTURE AND ALL LAND BEING READY TO HAVE A NEIGHBORHOOD OR A LARGE SUBDIVISION THERE'S MORE THAN PUTTING HOUSES ON OPEN FARMLAND THERE ARE OTHER CONSIDERATIONS TO MAKE.

>> YOU HAVE A LOT OF MONEY THAT GOES INTO LAYING OUT THE LAND TO MAKE SURE YOU HAVE YOUR SEWER AND WATER AND ELECTRICITY AND THEY TAKE TIME TO PUT TOGETHER, YES.

>> THAT IS A REALLY IMPORTANT POINT.

IT ISN'T JUST AS SIMPLE AS SAYING WE'RE GOING TO SELL-OFF 50 ACRES AND BUILD 100 HOMES.

THAT IS WHAT I HOPE AS WE GO INTO THE BUDGET CYCLE NOT THIS COMING SESSION BUT THE NEXT WHEN WE ARE LOOKING AT THE ROAD PLAN AND THINKING HOW WE'RE GOING TO REDEVELOP THAT WE CAN PRIORITIZE PUTTING MONEY INTO AREAS WHERE INFRASTRUCTURE NEEDS TO BE DEVELOPED.

BECAUSE ONE OF THE INTERESTING THINGS WE'VE HEARD ON THE TASK FORCE SO FAR IS THE NUMBER OF PEOPLE COMMUTING FROM ONE CITY TO ANOTHER AREA IN ORDER TO WORK.

AND WHAT THAT TELLS ME IS THAT PEOPLE ARE WILLING TO GO THE DISTANCE.

BUT HOW DO WE CONNECT THE WINCHESTER WORKER TO LEXINGTON?

CAN WE BUILD OUT WINCHESTER ROAD FOR EXAMPLE AND MAKE THAT MORE ATTRACTIVE FOR HOME BUILDING.

NOT EVERY SINGLE FARM AREA IN KENTUCKY IS RIPE FOR THAT.

BUT THERE ARE PRIORITIES THAT WE COULD DO IN OUR BUDGETING PROCESS SO THAT WE REALLY MAXIMIZE OUR INFRASTRUCTURE GROWTH AND THEN THE HOUSING GROWTH CAN FOLLOW.

>> Renee: AND ALSO PUBLIC TRANSIT MAYBE PEOPLE DON'T WANT TO SPEND AN HOUR-AND-A-HALF ON THE ROAD GETTING FROM POINT A TO POINT B.

IT'S MORE THAN JUST THE BUILDING ITSELF.

IT IS THE WATER, SEWER AND THE TRANSPORTATION WHICH THAT SEEMS LIKE A TOUGHER DEALING WITH THE PUBLIC TRANSIT.

>> AND TO CHARLES' POINT WHERE WE HAVE A SENSE OF URGENCY WHERE WE DO THIS.

BUT THERE CAN BE LAYERS WHERE MAYBE OUR FIRST PRIORITY IS WHERE THE PUBLIC TRANSIT FOCUS ON THE DENSITY WHERE THE PUBLIC TRANSIT ALREADY IS.

WHERE THE INFRASTRUCTURE ALREADY IS SO WE CAN FOCUS ON THOSE AREAS TO BUILD DENSITY TO JUST A QUICK FIX.

THIS IS A LONG-TERM ISSUE.

IT DIDN'T GET CREATED IN A YEAR OR TWO AND IT'S NOT GOING TO GO AWAY IN A YEAR OR TWO.

WE HAVE TO BE DISCIPLINED AND FIX WHAT WE CAN FIX.

AND THEN HAVE A ROAD PLAN FOR FIVE, 10, 20 YEARS DOWN THE ROAD.

>> I THINK WHEN YOU THINK ABOUT THE CHALLENGES OF TRYING TO BUILD MORE HOUSING WITH A LOT OF AGRICULTURAL LAND OR WHEN YOU ARE TRYING TO BUILD HOUSING WITH OTHER GEOGRAPHICAL LIMITATIONS LIKE MOUNTAINS, LAKES AND RIVERS WE HEARD ABOUT THEM AS WE TOURED THE STATE LEARNING ABOUT HOUSING CHALLENGES IN KENTUCKY THAT IS WHERE I THINK SOMETHING THAT MAYOR GREENBURG BROUGHT UP WHEN HE PRESENTED TO THE TASK FORCE LAST WEEK THAT COULD HELP A LOT OF THE RURAL COMMUNITIES THINKING MORE ABOUT LIGHT TOUCH DENSITY.

AND WHAT WE MEAN BY THAT ARE THINGS LIKE DUPLEXES, TRIPLEXES, TOWNHOMES PATIO HOMES THAT TYPE THOSE ARE WAYS WHERE YOU CAN HAVE VERY COMFORTABLE HOMES BUT ALSO BRING IN A LITTLE BIT MORE OF THAT DENSITY.

AND GOING BACK TO THE INFRASTRUCTURE CONVERSATION, WE HAVE A GREAT PROGRAM IN KENTUCKY FOR ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT.

KDBI.

SEEING A VERSION OF THAT FOCUSED ON RESIDENTIAL HOUSING WOULD BE A NICE PROGRAM.

WHAT I WOULD LIKE TO SEE IS TO HAVE A PROGRAM LIKE THAT THAT PRIORITIZES COMMUNITIES THAT ARE TAKING PROACTIVE STEPS TO MAKE SURE THAT THEIR LAND USED AND ZONING REGULATIONS ARE READY FOR MORE HOUSING IT IS A GOOD WAY TO THINK ABOUT INCENTIVIZING SOME OF THOSE REGULATORY CHANGES AT THE LOCAL LEVEL THAT WE ARE WANTS TO SEE TO ALLOW FOR DUPLEXES AND SO ON.

>> Renee: IT'S NOT ALL ABOUT OWNING A HOME YOUNGER GENERATIONS VALUE IT DIFFERENTLY.

I MEAN, WHAT IS THE PLIGHT OF THE RENTER IN KENTUCKY?

AND HOW MUCH SHOULD THEY EARN TO COMFORTABLY BE ABLE TO AFFORD A TWO BEDROOM, TWO BATH?

>> SURE.

WHEN WE THINK ABOUT PEOPLE WHO ARE RENTING IN KENTUCKY AND THEY ARE ONE OUT OF THREE OF US, THAT THEY MAYBE IN THEIR 20s, THEY MAYBE IN THEIR 60s.

THEY MAYBE ELDERLY THEY MAYBE DISABLED BUT THEY MAY BE IN A TRANSITORY PHASE OF LIFE.

MY FAMILY AND I HAVE RENTED AND WE HAVE OWNED AND WE HAVE RENTED AND WE'VE OWNED.

SO IT'S GOOD TO HAVE OPTIONS.

THE NATIONAL LOW INCOME HOUSING COALITION, THEY PUBLISH A COUPLE OF REPORTS.

ONE OF THEM IS THE OUT OF REACH REPORT.

WHICH SEEKS TO QUANTIFY WHAT IT TAKES TO AFFORD A MODEST TWO BEDROOM HOME TO RENT.

THIS YEAR'S REPORT RANKS KENTUCKY 38.

IF YOU ARE NUMBER ONE ON THIS LIST YOU ARE CALIFORNIA.

AND YOU DON'T WANT TO BE CALIFORNIA.

AND WHAT IS MOST INTERESTING TO ME IS THAT IT TIPPED OVER $20 PER HOUR THE STATE-WIDE HOUSING WAGE IS 20.97.

AND THE MOST INTERESTING THING TO ME IN LOOKING AT THE REPORT IS IN 2017 WHEN I STARTED THIS JOB, KENTUCKY RANKED NUMBER 50.

WE WERE THE MOST AFFORDABLE STATE.

AND THEN WE SLIPPED INTO THE 40s WE HOVERED THERE AND NOW WE ARE AT 38.

AND SO I THINK THE OPPORTUNITY AS WE HAVE TALKED ABOUT IS TO TURN THIS SHIP NOW.

BUT WE NEED TO DO IT NOW BEFORE WE SINK INTO DEEPER UNAFFORDABILITY.

>> Renee: WHAT DO THE KENTUCKY REALTORS WANT?

>> KENTUCKY REALTORS WOULD LIKE TO PROMOTE HOMEOWNERSHIP AND PROTECT PROPERTY RIGHTS THAT IS WHAT WE TRY TO DO MOST OF US ALL.

BUT IT'S ALSO MAKING HOMES AVAILABLE FOR PEOPLE THAT ACTUALLY WANT TO MAKE THAT TRANSITION NOT EVERYBODY WANTS TO BUY A HOME RIGHT AWAY.

BUT WE WANT TO MAKE IT AVAILABLE IF YOU ARE READY, WILLING AND ABLE TO BUY, WE CAN TAKE YOU THROUGH THAT PROCESS.

AND RIGHT NOW, THERE ARE SO MANY OBSTACLES TO THAT, AND IT TAKES US QUITE A BIT LONGER SOMETIMES TO DEAL WITH ESPECIALLY YOUNG PEOPLE OR YOUNG FAMILIES THAT REALLY NEED TO GET OUT OF MAYBE A ONE BEDROOM APARTMENT OR SOMETHING AND GET INTO THEIR OWN HOME.

THERE ARE SO MANY OBSTACLES WE CAN GUIDE THEM THROUGH AND THEY ARE JUST GOING TO HAVE TO SIT DOWN WITH A REALTOR AND SOMETIMES WE HAVE TO SIT DOWN WITH THEM AND GO OKAY YOU ARE NOT THERE YET LET'S MAKE A ROAD PLAN THAT IS GOING TO GET YOU THERE.

WE'RE WILLING TO WORK ACROSS THE SPECTRUM AND WORK WITH BUILDERS AND WORK WITH LAND OWNERS AND TRY TO EXPLAIN TO PEOPLE SIMPLE THINGS LIKE YOU HAVE BEEN TALKING ABOUT ADDING DUPLEXES AND TRIPLEXES AND ONE OF THE BIGGEST THINGS PEOPLE WILL SAY NO BECAUSE THAT IS GOING TO BE UNSIGHTLY AND IT WILL BRING TOO MUCH NOISE AND DISRUPT THE NEIGHBORHOOD.

WE HAVE TO EDUCATE PEOPLE ACROSS THE SPECTRUM THAT THAT IS NOT THE CASE AT ALL.

AND SO KENTUCKY REALTORS ARE TRYING VERY HARD TO MAKE SURE THAT WE CAN PUT THINGS LIKE THIS FIRST TIME HOME BUYERS PROGRAM INTO PLACE.

WE'RE TRYING TO WORK WITH OUR LEGISLATORS AND WITH OUR LENDERS TO TRY TO MAKE IT MORE AVAILABLE FOR PEOPLE TO GET INTO THIS.

AND THEN WE WOULD LOVE TO SEE BUILDERS BE ABLE TO GET THROUGH SOME OF THE REGULATIONS AND PLANNING AND ZONING SO THAT THEY CAN'T SIT THERE AND SAY WE CAN'T BUILD ANYTHING LESS THAN A 350,000 HOME BECAUSE THAT IS NOT ATTAINABLE FOR THE AVERAGE PERSON.

>> Renee: IS THERE A CONVERSATION ABOUT HELPING RENTERS MAKE THAT TRANSITION AND STAIR STEP IN TERMS OF TAX CREDITS THAT COULD BE OFFERED TO THEM?

OR IS THAT PART OF THE CONVERSATION YET?

>> IT COULD BE.

I THINK THAT EVERYONE AT LEAST I FEEL THAT HOMEOWNERSHIP IS ONE OF THE MOST IMPORTANT TENETS THAT WE CAN HAVE IN A SOCIETY AND STUDY AFTER STUDY SHOWS THERE IS A DIRECT CORRELATION BETWEEN HOMEOWNERSHIP AND LOW CRIME, HIGH WAGES MORE STABILITY.

SO NOT THAT I UNDERSTAND THAT APARTMENTS ARE NECESSARY PART OF EVERY COMMUNITY THAT WE HAVE IN KENTUCKY.

BUT REALLY TRYING TO FOCUS ON HOMEOWNERSHIP AND TRYING TO END THOSE BARRIERS AND GET IF WE CAN GET FIRST TIME INDIVIDUALS THAT NEVER OWNED A HOME IF WE CAN GET THEM IN A HOME THEN, I THINK WE'RE WELL ON OUR WAY.

>> Renee: THIS IS WHAT KENTUCKY HOUSING CORPORATION DOES, RIGHT?

>> CORRECT.

>> Renee: WHAT WOULD YOU BE IN A POSITION TO DO MORE OF OR LIKE TO DO MORE OF IN THAT REGARD?

>> WELL, LET ME BACK UP JUST A SECOND IF I CAN.

THERE WAS A POINT THAT THEY WERE BOTH MAKING THAT I THINK FITS TOGETHER AND THAT IS THE MORE PEOPLE THAT YOU MOVE OUT OF THE RENTAL MARKET INTO THE HOUSING MARKET, THE MORE UNITS OF HOUSING YOU FREE UP IN THE RENTAL MARKET.

AND SO IT IS AGAIN THIS CONTINUUM THAT WE WERE TALKING ABOUT.

WE'VE GOT TO INJECT MORE VOLUME, MORE SUPPLY AT WHATEVER LEVEL WE CAN EFFECTIVELY DO IT.

AND THAT'S A DECISION THAT THE LEGISLATURE WILL BE IS CURRENTLY FACING AND WRESTLING WITH.

BUT THERE'S GOT TO BE MORE SUPPLY.

AND IT CAN COME THROUGH RELAXING A LOT OF THE COSTS ASSOCIATING WITH ZONING AND OTHER REQUIREMENTS BUT IT CAN ALSO COME BY WAY OF OTHER INCENTIVES TO HELP BUILDERS AND DEVELOPERS BUILD MORE HOUSING.

>> Renee: WHAT ARE DEVELOPERS AND BUILDERS SAYING?

THAT THEY WANT?

>> THEY ARE SAYING THEY CAN'T AFFORD TO BUILD ANYTHING LESS THAN THE PRICE OF WHAT THINGS ARE GOING FOR.

IN OTHER WORDS, I'VE TALKED TO A BUILDER THE OTHER DAY THAT SAID THEY HAD BUILT SOME HOMES THAT SOLD FOR ALMOST $500,000 AND THE BUILDER BY THE TIME HE GOT THROUGH MADE VERY, VERY LITTLE ON THAT BECAUSE OF THE COST OF GOING INTO THAT.

YES, THAT WAS A SLIGHTLY LARGER HOME.

BUT I'VE ASKED BUILDERS COULD YOU BUILD ANYTHING 175 TO 200,000.

I CAN'T TOUCH IT.

AND THAT'S THAT PRICE POINT WE NEED TO GET INTO FOR THE FIRST TIME HOME BUYERS.

AND LIKE SUSAN WAS SAYING IF YOU CAN GET SOMEONE INTO A HOME YOU CAN START BUILDING WEALTH IN A WAY THE ONLY INVESTMENT THAT YOU CAN LIVE IN THAT COULD POSSIBLY NET YOU INCOME AND START A GENERATIONAL WEALTH FACTOR FOR YOU THAT YOU ARE NOT GOING TO GET WHEN RENTING.

NOTHING AGAINST RENTERS, BECAUSE LIKE YOU SAID, WE'VE BEEN IN RENTAL SITUATIONS WE'VE BEEN IN BUYING SITUATIONS.

BUT THE MORE PEOPLE YOU CAN GET INTO THE HOMEOWNERSHIP PART OF IT THE BETTER OFF YOU ARE GOING TO BE ACROSS THE BOARD FOR EVERYONE.

>> AND PRODUCING THIS REPORT WE SPENT A LOT OF TIME TALKING TO HOME BUILDERS AND WE DID THIS WITH THE HOME BUILDERS ASSOCIATION OF KENTUCKY.

EVERYTHING THAT PAM MENTIONED IS EXACTLY WHAT WE WERE HEARING THEY WOULD TRY TO GET AS MUCH AS THEY COULD WHAT THEY HAD AVAILABLE TO THEM.

DEALING WITH VERY HIGH SUPPLY COSTS AND ALSO WHEN YOU ARE STRUGGLING WITH MINIMUM LOT SIZES AND ESTHETIC REQUIREMENTS ALL THE TYPES OF THINGS, THEY WOULD FIND THEMSELVES PRODUCING A HOME AT A PRICE POINT THEY MAY NOT HAVE PREFERRED BECAUSE THERE'S ALL THE ADDED COSTS GOING UP.

WHAT WE HEAR FROM BUILDERS IS MAKE IT EASIER FOR US TO BUILD AND WE WILL BUILD IN.

>> Renee: I WANT TO MAKE A POINT ABOUT THE DENSITY CONVERSATION.

YOU MENTIONED, CHARLES, ABOUT QUAD PLEXES AND DUPLEXES THIS IS NOT THE HIGH-RISES OF THE 1960s AND WE NOTE THAT THOSE HAVE BEEN PROBLEMATIC WHEN IT COMES TO ENABLING CRIME AND HAVE NOT BEEN THE BEST CONDITIONS FOR COMMUNITY BUILDING.

IS THAT ALREADY OFF THE TABLE THAT THAT IS NOT A SOLUTION TO BUILD THOSE 19 STOREY HIGH-RISES?

>> I HAVE NOT HEARD ANYONE ARGUE TO BUILD HIGH-RISES.

I DON'T THINK THAT THAT'S THAT KENTUCKY HAS THE WILL OR THE DESIRE FOR THAT.

SO.

>> YEAH, I THINK YOU ARE RIGHT.

AND THE ONLY THING THAT IS REMOTELY CLOSE TO THAT IS REDEVELOPING OFFICE BUILDINGS INTO MARKET RATE PURCHASABLE OR RENT WHICH IS NOT COMPARABLE AT ALL.

>> AND EVEN THOSE I WOULD SEE ALMOST LIKE A MIXED MEDIA ON ITS OWN.

IF YOU TAKE A COMMERCIAL BUILDING YOU CAN CREATE IT TO BE ANYTHING THAT YOU WANT IT TO BE.

>> Renee: BUT MAYBE NOT AFFORDABLE IS THE THING THAT IT'S NOT.

>> THAT'S THE CHALLENGE.

>> YOU THINK ABOUT THE DOWNTOWN HISTORIC BUILDING THAT TO GET INTO THAT WOULD MAYBE NOT BE THE FIRST TIME.

>> WHAT IT WOULD COST TO REVAMP THAT AND MAKE IT RESIDENTIAL THE COSTS WOULD BE ALMOST PROHIBITIVE IN SOME AREAS TO DO THAT THAT IS CORRECT.

>> WE'VE GOT TO BE BRAVE AND LOOK, THOUGH, BECAUSE THERE ARE PLACES I LIVED IN A MIXED INCOME DEVELOPMENT IN CHICAGO.

IT WAS BEAUTIFUL.

LIKE REALLY BEAUTIFUL.

HISTORIC BUILDING THAT GOT REPURPOSED.

AND THERE WERE FULL RENTERS AND PEOPLE WHO WERE USING SUBSIDIZED HOUSING VOUCHERS.

AND WE ALL LIVED IN THE SAME PLACE AND EVERYBODY WAS USING THE SAME LAUNDRY MATT IN THE BASEMENT.

AND EVERYBODY WAS GRATEFUL TO BE ON A BUS LINE.

IT CAN WORK.

AND IT'S JUST SOMETHING WE HAVE TO BE BOLD ENOUGH TO LOOK FOR THOSE SOLUTIONS ELSEWHERE AND IMPLEMENT THEM AT HOME.

>> AND I THINK THAT WE ALL RECOGNIZE THERE IS NO SILVER BULLET ON THIS.

THERE IS NO OH, WHY DIDN'T I THINK OF THAT?

WE COULD SAY RIGHT NOW WE'RE GOING TO FULLY FUND GIVE YOU FUNDING FOR 100,000 HOMES.

WE DON'T HAVE THE MANPOWER TO BUILD THEM.

WE DON'T HAVE THE INFRASTRUCTURE.

SO EVEN IF YOU FIX ONE PROBLEM, YOU ARE TWO OR THREE MORE PROBLEMS POP-UP.

WHATEVER THE SOLUTIONS WE HAVE TO BE CREATIVE AND UNDERSTAND WE HAVE TO WORK BOTH WITH LOCAL GOVERNMENT, WE HAVE TO WORK WITHIN THE FEDERAL GUIDELINES.

IT'S GOING TO TAKE A LOT OF WORK BUT WE'RE WILLING TO DO IT.

WE ARE ALL HERE BECAUSE WE WANT TO DO IT.

>> Renee: GOING BACK TO THE BEGINNING OF THE CONVERSATION AND THE OPEN QUESTION OF WHAT IS THE ROLE OF STATE GOVERNMENT.

I THINK HOUSING IS SO INTERESTING, BECAUSE YOU'VE GOT FEDERAL AND YOU'VE GOT LOCAL.

AND I DO THINK THERE IS A ROLE FOR STATE GOVERNMENT AS WELL AS WE HAVE SOME ASSETS IN KENTUCKY THAT WE CAN BE PROUD OF.

AND MODELS THAT ARE WORKING THAT HAVEN'T BEEN SCALED UP AND SOLUTIONS THAT HAVE NOT BEEN CREATED YET.

IN TERMS OF I MENTIONED THE HOUSING TRUST FUNDS, THE WORK THAT IS BEING DONE BY COMMUNITY-BASED NONPROFITS AND DEVELOPERS BOTH IN URBAN AND RURAL COMMUNITIES, IT'S REALLY GREAT.

AND WE SHOULD BE PROUD OF THAT AND WE SHOULD BE FUNDING IT.

AND MODERNIZING THAT FUNDING SCHEME.

THE OTHER THING, TOO, IS WINSTON MENTIONED OKLAHOMA PUT IN 200 MILLION.

I'M NOT GOING ON RECORD ASKING FOR 200 MILLION DOLLAR APPROPRIATION INTO AN UNKNOWN FUNDING VEHICLE BUT WE SHOULD BE LOOKING AT WE'VE GOT A GREAT STATE HOUSING FINANCE AGENCY WE HAVE AN ENGAGED LEGISLATURE.

WE HAVE AN ENGAGED BUSINESS COMMUNITY.

AND SO LET'S PUT SOMETHING TOGETHER TO COME OUT OF THIS INTERIM IN THIS HOUSING TASK FORCE THAT WE CAN MOVE THE CONVERSATION FORWARD.

>> Renee: LAST WORD CHARLES AULL?

>> I THINK THE LAST THING WE WOULD LEAVE FOLKS WITH IS THE IMPORTANCE OF JUST BUILDING MORE HOUSING AT ALL DIFFERENT PRICE POINTS AND THAT IS GOING TO BE CRITICAL NOT ONLY FOR MAINTAINING KENTUCKY'S GREAT QUALITY OF LIFE AND MAKING SURE WE CAN GROW OUR ECONOMY IN A SUSTAINABLE WAY AND CONTINUE MOVING IT FORWARD.

HOUSE SOMETHING A CRITICAL PART OF THAT.

>> Renee: AND ATTENDING THE KENTUCKY HOUSING CORPORATION CONFERENCE ON WEDNESDAY IF THERE ARE SLOTS OPEN IN LOUISVILLE.

>> WE WOULD LOVE TO SEE YOU THERE.

>> Renee: IF NOT, PERHAPS THERE WILL BE MATERIALS UPLOADED TO THE SITE TO HELP INFORM PEOPLE AS WELL.

>> ABSOLUTELY.

I WOULD LIKE TO ADD ONE THING.

HADN'T BEEN SAID ALL NIGHT BUT HOUSING IS WHERE JOBS SLEEP AT NIGHT.

AND I KNOW EACH OF YOU ALL HEARD THIS AT OTHER PEOPLE PRESENTATIONS AND IT'S NOT MINE BUT IT PLAYS INTO WHAT CHARLES IS SAYING ABOUT ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT.

AND IF WE HAVE MORE HOUSING ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT LEVEL THEN WE'RE GOING TO HAVE MORE AFFORDABLE HOUSING FOR OTHER PEOPLE.

>> Renee: GOOD, WISE WORDS TO END ON.

THANK YOU IT'S BEEN A GOOD DISCUSSION.

WE'LL FOLLOW THE TASK FORCE.

YOU CAN WATCH THAT LIVE AS IT HAPPENS ON KET.

AND CAN YOU GO BACK AND SEE IT ON-LINE ON KET.ORG.

WE'RE OFF NEXT MONDAY BECAUSE OF THE DEMOCRATIC NATIONAL CONVENTION BUT WE WILL BE BACK IN TWO WEEKS TO DISCUSS POLITICS AND THE UPCOMING NOVEMBER ELECTION.

I WILL SEE YOU TOMORROW NIGHT AT 6:30 FOR KENTUCKY EDITION.

TAKE CARE.

SO LONG.